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 Post subject: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 10:04 pm 
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proff. patpending
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Whilst tinkering, I noticed my throttle cable was frayed, with at least two of the strands broken:
Image Image
So, based on availability of parts (I am sure I would have to wait for a new cable), the cost of them and generally to punish HD I decided to make do and mend...

So, I went on tinternet looking for 6mm dia 6mm long brass nipples and some 1.5mm diameter galvanised steel cable (stainless needs special flux so I am told). Best I could find for nipples was 6mm diameter 5.75mm long (some scooter place on EBay) and I treated myself to some 1.5mm "wire rope" from http://www.venhill.co.uk (the closest that Venhill could offer in terms of nipples were 8mm long which would protrude in the throttle body flange, 7.2mm thick on X1/M2FB/XB/1125 and 7.7mm thick on S1/S2/M2RB/S3 or 4.2mm which I thought would get lost - :run: )

Each cable, on the S1, was just over a metre long, so bear that in mind if buying cable.

Anyway, I digress...

I got all the stuff I needed:
Image Image Image

I put a nipple on the end of the "wire rope", frayed the end and pushed the nipple back up so the frayed wire did not protrude.
Image

Then, I heated the baby up and dipped it into my Bakers soldering fluid to "clean" the surface up:
Image Image

Then heated it up again, fed the solder in and re-dipped in the Bakers...
Image
(...next time I do this I will us a big FCUKoff soldering iron so I don't blow combustion products over the nipple and cable)

And then tidied it up with a needle file...
Image

Next, I got the old cable and cut the nipple off (right at the nipple note) the "good end" with my Shimano cable cutters (Adam likes to use a chisel)...
Image
...then used it to cut the new cable to length (plus 6mm for the nipple) then I repeated the exercise above.

This is a great opportunity for you Mikuni fans to reduce the length of the cable. Here is a photo of a Motion Pro dedicated cable for S1 with Mikuni...
Image
The dedicated cable is the shorter of the two...

Sadly, for me, every silver lining has a cloud, and on opening up the throttle, the nice white cable guide was 90% worn through and fell apart when re-assembling.... :cry:
Image

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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 10:10 pm 
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Resident Bender
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fine effort :yup:
soon we'll all be doing this kinda thing :)

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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 12:03 am 
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Nick, that last photo is the reason I'm too scared to take mine apart. lOl

Nice work mate. I'll be making my own cables on my Triumph.

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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 6:03 am 
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Very good, though matts at eastville has all that in stock ;) if you ever need it quick in the future


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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 6:13 am 
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Nice writeup :yup:

pash wrote:
So, I went on tinternet looking for 6mm dia 6mm long brass nipples and some 1.5mm diameter galvanised steel cable (stainless needs special flux so I am told).

As a side note: I soldered some stainless throttle cables from Venhill with good success, using some flux for stainless. The back side label of the bottle tells me it's made from "zinc chloride, solution UN 1840", but maybe, it's just called "special" and in reality it's just another ordinary flux:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soldering_flux
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zinc_chloride
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_UN_Numbers

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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 6:44 am 
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proff. patpending
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bikerdude666 wrote:
Very good, though matts at eastville has all that in stock ;) if you ever need it quick in the future

I'll be down there on Tuesday as I have another cable to fix...

gunter wrote:
Nice writeup :yup:

Nothing new, just showing how easy it is to sort yourself out and not to be a slave to new parts which are no longer available, on back order or well expensive...

gunter wrote:
pash wrote:
So, I went on tinternet looking for 6mm dia 6mm long brass nipples and some 1.5mm diameter galvanised steel cable (stainless needs special flux so I am told).

As a side note: I soldered some stainless throttle cables from Venhill with good success, using some flux for stainless. The back side label of the bottle tells me it's made from "zinc chloride, solution UN 1840", but maybe, it's just called "special" and in reality it's just another ordinary flux

Venhill didn't have any stainless cable option on their website, but there are plenty of bicycle brake cables in stainless... I would think galvanised steel is better due to its longer fatigue life...

mojomick wrote:
Nick, that last photo is the reason I'm too scared to take mine apart. lOl

Ignorance is bliss... But this could have written off the beautiful switchgear and throttle and grip... (anyone know what it is common to?)...

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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 7:17 am 
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pash wrote:
bikerdude666 wrote:
Very good, though matts at eastville has all that in stock ;) if you ever need it quick in the future

I'll be down there on Tuesday as I have another cable to fix...



now he'll prove me wrong and not have any of it! lol


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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2011 11:38 am 
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Made up my own cables years ago for a NSU Quickly...what a machine...????

Anyway...all the cables were fine except I think the clutch which seemed to want to pull the soldered nipples off the cables regularly....

This was even with lots of cable fraying and bending and best solder etc....I always felt I couldnt get a solder "hard" enough and when load was applied it was too soft....maybe brazing rod would have been better ??????

So ok for throttle cables but wouldnt use for clutch etc.

Eric

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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2011 11:50 am 
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Soft solder is fine for any cable (even used it on stainless), it's even been used for RP brass nuts used for climbing protection. The trick is getting the 'tinning' process done properly and using a good flux. Too much heat (braze/silver solder etc) can lead to a hardening of the cable where it leaves the nipple and when it bends, it can become brittle. A high Wattage electric iron is the answer ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2011 3:43 pm 
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proff. patpending
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Yep, and it is not the solder that holds the nipple to the cable, it is the solder that prevents the splayed cable from reforming and travelling back through the hole in the nipple.

Back in the 80s, my first cable making experience was throttle cables for my Yammagamma, however my old man had been making them for years and at the time I was mimic-ing Stan Stevens, he was mating Amal Monoblocks to Tomaselli QA throttles for hillclimb beasts... Them were the days...

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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2011 6:58 pm 
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Adam wrote:
Soft solder is fine for any cable (even used it on stainless), it's even been used for RP brass nuts used for climbing protection. The trick is getting the 'tinning' process done properly and using a good flux. Too much heat (braze/silver solder etc) can lead to a hardening of the cable where it leaves the nipple and when it bends, it can become brittle. A high Wattage electric iron is the answer ;)

What flux do you use with stainless Adam? - I'm fixing my "william tell" style car window reulator at the mo' and want to use stainless cable ideally.


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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2011 7:35 pm 
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Dunno Mate, the tin is at least 40 yrs old and was passed down to me by my Dad lOl
It just says 'flux for soft solder' on it. It smells the same and has the same colour as a tin of flux I bought from Maplins though ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2011 7:39 pm 
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Adam wrote:
Dunno Mate, the tin is at least 40 yrs old and was passed down to me by my Dad lOl
It just says 'flux for soft solder' on it. It smells the same and has the same colour as a tin of flux I bought from Maplins though ;)


I suspect the tails on LED's etc are stainless rather than 'Brassed' steel, and it works fine on those as well as bike cables. Like Pash says, the trick is to splay the cable in the nipple.

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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 5:19 pm 
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Adam wrote:
Dunno Mate, the tin is at least 40 yrs old and was passed down to me by my Dad lOl
It just says 'flux for soft solder' on it. It smells the same and has the same colour as a tin of flux I bought from Maplins though ;)


Strange you should say that - my tin was also passed from Dad and has a rather jolly looking devil with an iron in his hand on the lid! Bakers I think, but there is no way I could get the cable tinned even after solvent cleaning and scraping it for all I was worth. I thought that something really agressive was needed to remove the oxide layer with staino?


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 Post subject: Re: Make do and Mend
PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 5:49 pm 
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That's the stuff. Green tin about 3" across and 3/4" deep. Where was your Dad in 1958? ;) lOl lOl

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